2016 Poets&Quants’ MBA Ranking

by: John A. Byrne on November 21, 2016 | 141 Comments 481,073 Views

poetsquants-2016top100usmbaprograms-01

The Definitive List Of The Top 100 U.S. MBA Programs of 2016 — 76 to 100

2016
Rank		School Name2015 RankIndexUS
News		ForbesBusiness
Week		Financial
Times		The Economist
#76South Carolina (Moore)6416.471 (74)NR (NR)62 (NR)NR (49)NR (49)
#77Willamette (Atkinson)8014.0NR (NR)60 (60)76 (70)NR (NR)NR (NR)
#78University of San Diego7613.7NR (NR)NR (NR)83 (NE)28 (32)NR (NR)
#79Arkansas (Walton)8213.363 (63)NR (NR)NR (NR)NR (NR)NR (NR)
#79Tennessee-Knoxville (Haslam)7113.363 (63)NR (NR)NR (64)NR (NR)NR (NR)
#81Utah (Eccles)7513.079 (70)NR (NR)66 (59)NR (NR)NR (NR)
#82UC-San Diego (Rady)6112.877 (63)NR (NR)72 (65)NR (48)NR (NR)
#83Fordham (Gabelli)9912.683 (NR)NR (NR)59 (72)NR (NR)NR (NR)
#84Rollins (Crummer)8412.3NR (NR)52 (52)NR (NR)NR (NR)NR (NR)
#85Hofstra (Zarb)8810.8NR (NR)58 (58)NR (NR)NR (NR)NR (NR)
#86Iowa State8210.571 (63)NR (NR)NR (NR)NR (NR)NR (NR)
#87Syracuse (Whitman)8910.185 (90)NR (NR)71 (67)NR (NR)NR (NR)
#88Howard9210.091 (NR)NR (NR)58 (50)NR (NR)NR (NR)
#89Chapman (Argyros)869.981 (83)NR (NR)82 (63)NR (NR)NR (NR)
#90University of Louisville879.175 (70)NR (NR)NR (NR)NR (NR)NR (NR)
#90Massachusetts-Amherst (Isenberg)NR9.175 (74)NR (NR)NR (NR)NR (NR)NR (NR)
#92Mississippi968.192 (NR)NR (NR)68 (69)NR (NR)NR (NR)
#93DePaul (Kellstadt)NR7.779 (95)NR (NR)NR (NR)NR (NR)NR (NR)
#94Houston (Bauer)NR7.192 (95)NR (NR)75 (NR)NR (NR)NR (NR)
#95Kentucky (Gatton)706.392 (91)NR (NR)80 (73)NR (NR)NR (NR)
#96Rochester Institute of Technology (Saunders)1005.685 (91)NR (NR)NR (NR)NR (NR)NR (NR)
#97Binghamton-SUNYNR4.688 (95)NR (NR)NR (NR)NR (NR)NR (NR)
#97St. Louis (Cook)974.688 (88)NR (NR)NR (NR)NR (NR)NR (NR)
#97Kansas974.688 (88)NR (NR)NR (NR)NR (NR)NR (NR)
#100Texas Tech (Rawls)1003.6NR (91)NR (NR)77 (NR)NR (NR)NR (NR)

Note: * Ranks for both The Financial Times and The Economist surveys are U.S. only, not the overall global ranks

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  • M7Grad

    I think it’s more representative of the fact that Columbia is almost unilaterally last choice among people with cross admittance at M7 schools that are targeting consulting roles. It is a great program and clearly ahead of the “tier 2” schools for consulting/ib placement etc. And these things fluctuate with time, I wouldn’t expect it to stay that way forever (such as how Wharton used to unilaterally be placed above above the other M7 programs – now they’re not – etc).

    I’d expect these perceptions to fluctuate over the years as schools evolve but at this point in time, Columbia is definitely feeling pressure to ‘catch up’ to their peer programs. This is clear when you attend their recruiting events.

  • avivalasvegas

    Overall, I overwhelmingly agree with this assessment except on the premium given to Wharton. My closest MBB Princi -pals tell me that Wharton is treated on par with the other programs. Only HBS gets some degree of a premium.

  • After doing MBA, I have lost trust and interest in this whole ranking thing. Except top 20 or 30, rest all is very subjective and unreliable

  • LOL

    Laughing so hard @ your delusion. “Wall Street perspective”, really?
    If you think it’s anything other than H S W B K as the top 5, you’re clearly delusional. Nobody in their right mind is picking Columbia, Yale, Stern or Tuck over Kellogg. Sloan, maybe for the techie types who don’t care much about the student experience.

  • mackmiller

    After studying this deeply and looking at a number of relevant factors (e.g., where the world is moving re technology), it is pretty clear cut that the best bet business schools – as a tier – are the following:

    TIER ONE (in a league of their own)

    MIT Sloan
    Standford GSB

    TIER TWO (very good schools, but not as advanced re tech)

    Harvard Business School
    Chicago Booth

    TIER THREE (a rising star)

    Carnegie Mellon Tepper

  • James

    This is how I see the tiers. I ordered them from left to right within tiers as well.

    1 Stanford=Harvard
    2 Wharton
    3 MIT=Booth=Kellogg
    4 Haas=Tuck=Yale=Columbia
    5 Stern=Ross=Darden=Fuqua
    6 Anderson=Johnson

  • James

    Good, but I’d move Ross down to 3 and Yale up to 3. Next year Yale will probably be at 2.

  • karl0266

    Based on school’s prestige and Wall Street perspective.

    1. Harvard
    2. Penn Wharton = Stanford
    4. Columbia = MIT Sloan = Chicago Booth = Dartmouth Tuck
    8. Yale = NYU Stern
    10. Northwestern Kellogg

    I know that kids at Kellogg would go mad about this. But this is what it is.
    The fact that Kellogg has BS one year program is another factor for deduction in points as well.

  • Ethan

    I came across Singapore Management University (“SMU”) a few years ago. SMU is a young but highly innovative Asian university, focused on business management, accounting and economics as well as Law. SMU is definitely gaining ground fast across global rankings and its graduates are recognised in Singapore and gradually in Asia as one of the most dynamic and global in outlook. Established in 2000, with just 16 years of history, SMU has made huge strides and is beginning to challenge the more established National University of Singapore (“NUS” – Ranked #1 in Asia and #12 globally ) and The Nanyang University of Technology – Singapore.

    Within the next decade, I am confident that SMU will rank Among the Top 10 business schools in Asia and within the Top 50 globally. With Singapore’s demonstrated track record and renowned prowess in education (from secondary to tertiary) globally, SMU certainly has the potential of becoming the London School of Economics (“LSE”) of Asia. This is one dynamic and high achieving university to watch out for in the coming years.

  • jibjab

    Disagree with this list. Specifically, including Johnson, Stern, and Anderson. I think they are a tier down…only a few people go to MBB from those schools.

  • We annually publish a separate list of the best international full-time MBA programs. You can see it here:

    http://poetsandquants.com/2016/12/19/poetsquants-2016-ranking-best-international-business-schools/

    Of course, the FT and the Economist publish global MBA rankings and therefore compare Oxford and Cambridge against a broader set of schools. So that is where you might get a sense for how these programs compare with the top U.S. business schools. It’s important to keep in mind that the FT list, in particular, is designed to be more favorable to non-U.S. programs.

  • Cam

    These (and in particular this list here) rarely include international MBAs correct? Essentially just top US MBAs? Wondering how schools like Oxford/Cambridge would play into this (especially given they only have 1 year programs)

  • how then

    Thats a frankly pretty shitty score

  • how then

    What a douche. Like there is a “tier” difference between harvard, wharton, MIT, and Columbia.
    When your tier consists of one school you know you have an utterly worthless tier system.

  • Jan. 30

  • Greg

    Do you know when the ft ranking is due?

  • B to the Ryzzo

    Excellent point…successful people aren’t successful because of the school they attended, they’re successful because of their work ethic and intelligence…

  • DACochran

    Congrats on your MBA journey. Do you mind me asking what field you were targeting going into the MBA, what you ended up doing as an internship, and if you’ve already secured employment full time? I ask because I went to a 20-30 ranked school and got the same job in consulting I would have out of a top5, however it was certainly a more difficult road. I’m curious to hear your thoughts. Also, I assume you received a generous(full?) scholarship offer? Similar scenario for myself.

  • DACochran

    I think this is an outstanding list. One note: I know not all of MBB recruit on campus at McCombs, I’m not sure about Emory but McCombs might not be that same class. It may be completely firm-dependent on whether McCombs/Rice/Olin/Owen is the better option.

  • DACochran

    I really hope you don’t encourage or even stand idly by while people believe that. I can’t speak to Wharton but I thought that about HBS and therefore wasn’t going to apply, I am eternally grateful that a friend who went there encouraged me to “go change it” if I felt that way about the culture. Of course I interviewed and spoke to many people at HBS and they were all amazing people. I’m confident there are assholes there but there are quite a few assholes in my program as well.

    You should be encouraging the people you work with to take the time to really understand the culture of the schools they decide whether or not to apply to. HBS is too good of an opportunity to pass up based on haters who didn’t get in and want to smear their name.

    The same thing happened in consulting btw, the firm/s that are supposed to be douchey based on their reputation had some of the most caring people I’ve ever met. My internship revealed the people working with me really cared about me (I was surprised at how much time was spent talking to each other about our non-work lives) and I’m thrilled to go back.

    Challenge assumptions, don’t make them.

  • DACochran

    lol that’s the same troll just trying to get a rise out of you. Neat trick but it doesn’t work with Disqus users bro, you don’t show up as blue.

  • m7student

    Fuqua is a good school but is not not part of M7. M7 consists of: H,S,W,B,K,CBS,MIT

  • Inseadsux

    It amazes me that insead would come top in this ranking, I am an insead alumni and the product was zero value add to my career. I think that there is a Simpson’s paradox in insead’s stats covering up the fact that native English speakers do not do well there. If the only language that you speak NATIVELY is English you will do better at a top US school. Do not go there with AP Spanish or a year in Munich during your degree.

    Just last weekend I was speaking to my friend who went to Columbia, he was telling me that their Alumni email group regularly receives job postings from major firms. There isn’t even a mail group like that for insead. The US insead Alumni group on LinkedIn was set up 2 years ago, there are 8 posts, seven from the school selling the annual networking event and one alumni self promotion piece. Small examples, taken in aggregate makes a major difference.

  • Good one!

    I’m actually a Johnson alumnus, so… 🙂

  • Johnny

    Great Comment. It’s very entertaining to see so many people parse 10-12 programs into so many distinctive groups. The reality is that if you took a random sample of 30 to 40 students from each of the top programs and removed the line in the resume that indicates which school that person attends, the students would be roughly indistinguishable.

  • sternie

    You realize this ranking is heavily impacted by USNEWS placing Stern at #20 due to a clerical error? the ranking is artificial. The consensus is that USNEWS is the most reliable ranking due to stability and reliance on hard metrics – stern was consistently in the 8 to 11 range before the error

  • MBA alum

    I find it somewhat humorous how so many of the commentators are convinced that their MBA program is clearly superior to other MBA programs that are ranked well above them on P&Q, US News and other MBA rankings. I believe that a subtle contributing factor to this trait is due to the ever increasing emphasis across MBA programs on teambuilding, networking and bonding among classmates. I often hear from my recent MBA graduate colleagues on how their respective MBA program places far more emphasis on team building compared to other MBA programs that are more cut throat and competitive among classmates. The net result is that MBAs often complete their program feeling much closer to their school and their classmates. While this is a very good trend, it can contribute to somewhat inflated feelings about one’s own MBA program.

  • updated2017rankings

    Also 2015 P&Q Rankings Official behind UCLA again

    #16 New York (Stern)

    Any questions?

    Stern sucks and overpriced like crazy anyway so not sure what’s so surprising

  • updated2017rankings

    2016 P&Q Rankings Official

    #17 New York (Stern)

    Any questions?

  • Unsubscribe please

  • whatthe

    Since when is Stern Tier 7? Stern is at or higher the level of Ross/Darden/Fuqua according to most reasonable bus. people

  • updated2017rankings

    Stern is below 5 and you must be kissing about SOM at tier 4. Too many insecure SOM students on this board in every comment section. Most accurate and realistic list taking into account recent changes:

    2017 tiers look like:

    1. Harvard/Stanford
    2. Wharton
    3. Booth/Kellogg/MIT
    4. Columbia
    5. Haas/Tuck
    6. Ross/Fuqua/Johnson/Darden/SOM
    7. Anderson/Stern

  • updatedupdatedranks

    you’re kidding right? Stern and SOM in the last tier?

    your list should be:

    1. Harvard/Stanford
    2. Wharton
    3. Kellogg/Booth
    4. MIT/Haas/CBS/Tuck/SOM
    5. Stern
    6. Ross/Fuqua/Darden
    7. Anderson/Johnson

  • curious

    Where is your source?

  • ivy

    God Tier:
    Harvard, Stanford, Wharton, Tuck, Yale

    everything else

  • Realist

    Both FrequentFlyer and yourself are dummies. He is saying that he works for a top consulting firm, which isn’t MBB. Well, guess he couldn’t make it to the real top consulting firm.

    And you are a dummy cause he clearly said not MBB. You guys both need to go back to school.

  • col

    What? Columbia is second tier in your MBB consulting firm?
    I guess they really are now in the playground of Ross/Yale/Duke

  • updated2017rankingstoo

    Hahaha Columbia is barely top 10.

  • updated2017rankings

    For consulting its more flat

    1-H,B,K,W
    2 MIT,CBS,Tuck,Ross
    3 S, Hass, Duke
    4 Yale, Johnson, Stern, Anderson

  • updated2017rankingstoo

    2017 tiers look like:

    1. Harvard/Stanford
    2. Booth
    3. Kellogg/Wharton
    4. MIT/Haas/Tuck
    5. Columbia
    6. Ross/Fuqua/Johnson/Darden
    7. Anderson/Stern/SOM

  • Makes Sense

    Yes. Booth has been in the ascendant in the rankings for 15 years and it has not abated. It is trending well and the gains are real. I agree that it should be 1/2 with Harvard by now.

    Columbia trended downwards, performing so badly first and it is now below Top 10. It is the ugly redheaded stepchild of the M7 family.
    Wharton has trended badly in the past 10 years and it is now almost at the bottom of the M7, just above Columbia
    Stanford is signaling that it will follow Wharton’s downward trajectory
    Kellogg is treading water, with a slight downward trend
    MIT is flat, happy where it is. It goes up and down based on the other M7’s performance rather than its own.

    Harvard has benefited from Stanford’s decline, solidifying its position at #1

  • Columbiatch

    Columbia is the shame of the M7. Tuck should have been in its place.

    Columbia is barely Top 10

  • StanfordSucks

    Everyone who cares about the rankings read USN in the boardroom, in abusiness flight and everywhere else.

    People read the Economist, FT and WSJ in the boardrooom but their read these magazines rankings so that they can LAUGH at their rankings.

  • HarvardWinsAgain

    Disagree on one point. Harvard wins over Chicago Booth. It’s Stanford that is really below Booth.

  • Movies, popular culture. The halo effect of the undergraduate University.

  • Businessweek uses a different criteria for rankings than other publishers. They focus on alumni success and satisfaction, and employer satisfaction with alums.

  • M7hopeful

    Duke isn’t M7. HBS/GSB/Wharton/Kellogg/Booth/MIT/CBS = M7. Duke is generally held to be a top 10-15 school.

    Business Week’s rankings are sketchy at best right now. Any ranking that places Rice–a program that had a grand total of 775 applicants last year and boasts average GPA/GMAT of 3.3/676–over Kellogg (3.6/728), CBS (3.5/717), Haas (3.64/717), Darden (3.5/712), and SOM (median 3.65/730) simply doesn’t pass the smell test. I doubt you could pay someone enough money to choose Rice over any of those schools.

  • MBA alum

    Your suggestion that Booth does far better than GSB in job placement does not seem to be consistent with industry job placement statistics. Let’s look at MBA job placement for the four most competitive fields (not counting high tech, which is GSB strength) using stats from P&Q and Pitchbook. To properly analyze these four fields, it is important to note that Booth’s average FT class is 43% larger than GSB and about 100% larger if you include part-time MBA alums. GSB has 525 alums working at the top 9 consulting firms with 75% at MBB. Booth has 1,142 at these top 9 consulting firms with only 39% at MBB. Despite being much smaller, GSB alums represent 17.1% of the management teams in the venture capital industry compared to only 4.3% alums from Booth. Likewise, GSB has 76 alums working in the Private Equity industry compared to only 42 from Booth. It is only in investment banking where Booth does much better than GSB in terms of alumni base. Booth has 1,125 alumni working at the top 10 investment banking firms which is 4x the 271 GSB alums at these 10 IB firms. This may be due to the concentration of IB jobs in NYC. GBS alums have a much stronger geographical preference for working in northern California.

  • ChrisSmolickinson

    How is it possible that fuqua is top 3! in Business week yet lower than all of the other m7’s on P&Q. As an M7 shouldn’t it simply be top 7 in all rankings

  • MBAconsulting

    Why would Duke alternate into top 10? Not knocking your assumption just wondering? They aren’t ranked top 10 in any of the the real rankings. They aren’t even top 12 in any of the real rankings….

    The only ranking anyone actually considers is USNWR and they bounce betwen #12-14.

  • C Taylor

    Duke is a really good school. not sure why it gets some so much cr@p on this site. I ultimately choose Georgetown but got into Duke Fuqua and was really considering it. They have a very friendly down to earth atmosphere. The low GMAT did concern me for sure, but I felt like the students were just as smart as kids at UCLA/Johnson etc…

  • HBSalum

    Is that even possible…no trying to be rude but the sub 700 gmat at Fuqua would be a major concern/red-flag if I were looking in that tier. I think I got a 690 prior to even opening a GMAT book.

    Not sure about Cornell johnson…lol

  • RRK850

    You seem too young or inexperienced or somehow immature. In business, finance, economics, University of Chicago is by faaar better than Stanford. Chicago strength with many nobel laureates is reflected on its MBA program. Stanford strength is by its location in the valley and number of its grads entrepreneurial adventures. But, the reality is that almost all the very top elitist financiers, bankers, and money managers know that Chicago and wharton are the two leader in the business and finance. While Wharton is wharton with its unmatched history, Chicago managed to master the knowledge and went deeper into economics and finance the way no other school did. Chicago impact on this is superior even to Harvard. Stanford is just a parasite on its location success and some computer science alumni. Chicago, Harvard, MIT, all are much better than Stanford in the business and economics area.

  • BAKEKANG

    LoL… Did you not read my entire post?
    It appears that you only read my last sentence which was a very stupid thing to do, specially when you try to rebut someone who was making a very sound point.
    Admit rate wasn’t the only thing I said. Read my entire post before you even try to rebut my comment.

    Chicago Booth is a very good b-school. But it isn’t in Stanford GSB’s league. Stanford GSB stands head and shoulders superior to Chicago Booth. And, every Booth student could only wish he’s admitted to Stanford, but the reverse isn’t true. I would even go far and say, Berkeley Haas is now gradually overtaking Chicago Booth.

  • RRK850

    if the admit rate is your factor for elitism, then IIM-A should be the world’s best. You have serious problem. Over time you will grow and realize that Booth is way better than HBS and Wharton, let alone Stanford which considered by many as lower business school.

  • BAKEKANG

    That is wishful thinking.

    Booth couldn’t even win against Berkeley Haas in the cross-admit battles (Haas survey wins over Booth 72% – 28%) and Haas is generally considered inferior to Stanford GSB. Even Harvard losses to Stanford GSB in the same (unpublished) survey, 81%-19%.
    Furthermore, Chicago or Booth does not have the prestige and “wow” factor that Stanford has, nationally or internationally. And, I am willing to wager that almost everyone, if not practically everyone, at Booth would be very much willing to swap places with those at Stanford GSB, but the reverse would be impossibly the same.
    Booth couldn’t match the resources of Stanford GSB. U of Chicago as a whole couldn’t match the resources of Stanford University, as well. Stanford is way too rich, too powerful, too high-end, too posh, too fabulous, too elite to be compared to Chicago Booth. They don’t fall in the same league. And, the gap that separates them is huge it’s sane to try to compare them or even mention them in the same sentence, to be frank about it.
    The only business school that rivals Stanford GSB is HBS, period.
    Chicago Booth’s admit rate of 25% is far from being a super elite school.

  • Orange

    I’ve been at an MBB firm for the last 4 years and have been involved in recruiting quite a bit. If you’re recruiting for consulting, it’s probably something like:

    1. HARVARD – At least one MBB has a policy that any HBS student that applies gets an interview, regardless of resume, which I don’t think is true at any other school.

    2. WHARTON – Still one of the strongest brand names and a huge class size means a top firm can go in and get 50+ hires in the same place

    3. KELLOGG – I don’t think they’re #3 OVERALL, but if you’re interested in consulting and can’t get into HBS or Wharton, this is probably your next best bet. They send a TON of people to MBB and it’s an industry that gets a ton of attention (# of students recruiting) and resources (investment in a quality consulting club)

    4. BOOTH – Great school and also sends scores of people to MBB each year. I put them below Kellogg b/c I think there’s a perception that finance recruiting ends up drawing a lot of the quality students at Booth (at least more on a percentage basis as compared to Kellogg)

    5. COLUMBIA – Similar story to Booth, in terms of there being a perception that a lot of quality students there recruit for finance instead of consulting, but still a pretty good place to get into MBB. I put them below Booth, because I do feel like Booth has a better geographic reach (e.g., sending more people to the West Coast, Midwest, and South than Columbia for consulting). If you want to get into MBB in the Northeast or maybe even mid-Atlantic region, Columbia might be a better bet. Also, like Booth / Wharton / HBS, CBS has a huge class size, so firms like the ability to come in and swoop up 30-40 hires at a time.

    6. STANFORD – You will find a lot of FORMER MBB analysts at Stanford, but not nearly as many heading TO MBB firms. Still, the Stanford GSB brand is incredibly strong, especially on the West Coast. On a percentage and absolute basis, though, I think you will find less of the GSB class heading to MBB than the other schools listed above.

    7. TUCK – Tuck has had some pretty eye-popping numbers in the last couple of years when it comes to percentage of people they send to MBB. However, I think once you get down to this point on my list, similar to my comments about CBS above, geography becomes a factor. Tuck is still a great school if you are looking for a consulting job in the Northeast / Mid-Atlantic. It becomes tougher on the West Coast / South / Midwest, since there will be fewer Tuck alums at MBB firms in those regions.

    8. MIT – I never got the sense that consulting was really a focus industry at MIT like it is at some of the other schools in the M7. Like, Stanford, though, I think the strength of the brand name still carries a lot of weight, so I would put it in the top 10 regardless. Definitely stronger in the Northeast / Mid-Atlantic than other parts of the country, though.

    After you get past those top 8, I think it becomes MUCH more of a regional game. You have a lot of schools that are about on the same plane when it comes to consulting, but will be much stronger in their respective geographic regions. This is due to the presence of alums in the regional offices of those consulting firms (e.g., the comment below about Duke sending more people to Deloitte Atlanta than any other school) who will fight for people from their institutions to get on the interview slate. I think that next tier looks something like this:

    9 (West Coast): HAAS – They have solidified their place in the top 10, which gives them a lot of pull with top firms. Even though there is a stereotype on the East Coast that they are narrowly focused on tech and entrepreneurship, they are definitely runner-up behind only Stanford when it comes to brand name on the West Coast.

    9 (Midwest): ROSS – They have some great stats in the last couple of years when it comes to number of people they sent to MBB and consulting is definitely an area of focus for them. I think their reach does extend out of the Midwest, but this is certainly where they are the strongest.

    9 (South / Mid-Atlantic): FUQUA – They have a huge alumni base in places like Atlanta, Charlotte, and DC. Consulting is a HUGE focus industry at Fuqua. Like Ross, they do send a lot of people outside of these regions, as well, but this is where their strength is.

    9 (Northeast / Mid-Atlantic): Yale SOM – Yale doesn’t have the advantage of having a large alumni base as many of the other schools on the list due to its smaller size and relatively young age, but is seen as an up-and-coming school that MBB firms are prioritizing more and more. Though SOM has traditionally been seen as a school for people interested in non-profit, that has changed quite a bit under the new dean, and more students now go into consulting than any other industry. Until 2011, BCG was the only MBB that actively recruited on campus. Today, it is a core school for all of the MBB and has in each of the last couple of years, sent nearly 10% of the graduating class to MBB. Still, most of the SOM alumni base in MBB is in NYC, Boston, and DC, so it’s probably tougher to get your foot in the door outside of that footprint.

    Beyond that top 12, I would say the next tier is probably:
    13 (West Coast): Anderson
    13 (South / Mid-Atlantic): Darden
    13 (Northeast): Johnson

    16 (South): Emory / McCombs
    16 (Mid-Atlantic / MidWest): Carnegie Mellon

  • Baruch

    By “people who know” you mean the recruiters? Any person spending so much money and time on an MBA just to worry what recruiters will think is a complete moron. Booth and Kellogg are perfect examples where the schools don’t have a brand name, but sell you the “access to recruiters” that you can get at other schools with a brand name as well. I am right, you are wrong. I got my MBA from Baruch, I clearly know what I am talking about.

  • Wut?

    John Hopkins doesn’t have an international brand regardless.

  • Orange

    Source?

  • radish

    Yes, ordinary people, who will also be impressed by Oxford and Cambridge MBAs because of the names of the mother universities, and when ask them INSEAD, those people will say what INSEAD! same applied to your case, the poster said “People who know” not the laymen. at the end students do MBA for the people WHO know not for the street folks, otherwise John Hopkins MBA would better than Emory!

  • MBAhopeful

    Maybe I am biased being originally from Eastern Europe, back home and many other countries the brands of Harvard, Stanford, Yale and Columbia appear to be the most prestigious. From my time in the US, it also appears to be true. People do not usually seem surprised when they meet someone from Chicago and Penn, vs those from Harvard and Stanford. Not sure why, but this is my perception.

  • HarvardStudent

    I applied to 6 schools last year and was accepted to HBS, Stanford, Wharton, Columbia, and MIT. The only school that dinged me was Booth.

    I think you make a good point.

  • Warren

    I respectfully disagree. Chicago full time MBA is the world’s best MBA programs. Chicago itself is the world’s leader in economics, Finance, and social sciences. People who know academic rigor, strong knowledge, and best students, know that Chicago have them all. It is no coincidence that major rankings rank Chicago Booth as the best business school in the world.

  • Chicago’s strong but..

    Chicago’s overall brand however is weaker. It’s just good to get a first job after an MBA, otherwise no one will be impressed that you got your MBA from Chicago.

  • Anti-LOLing

    you keep repeating the word LOL in almost every post. Be careful, it is a disease that you unconsciously addicte it and eventually you become the LOL guy.

  • elitist

    LOL who in business class flights or board rooms reads USN????
    people read FT and Forbes which focus on salary and outcome
    only those rankings maters

  • radish

    This is in fact a praise. Still in high school and aware of all the MBA stuff! very impressive.

  • Warren

    It already did. In many top recruiters view, Chicago and Harvard are the very best and top business schools in the world. Few see Stanford would come close to Chicago.

  • elitest

    actually CBS and Wharton also placed more at MBB than kellogg and booth
    PLEASE CHECK NUMBERS !!
    AND of course salaries are higher in NYC because u do bigger deals and work with higher profile clients
    U get far more exposure in NYC than in Charlottee
    The world’s economic capitals are New york and London because u work with the most high profile people and businesses
    Please dont tell me working in atlanta is the same exposure as working in NYC or London
    That’s why i say go with hard number salary rankings, all others is qualitiative BS
    They say for a reason, If u can make it in NYC, u can make it anywhere

  • tamix

    even if Berkeley ranked #1 and MIT #130 , still and by faaaaar, MIT is much much better, more prestigious, richer experience, more recognizable worldwide than this haas thing. In FT they put french institute #1 and no single person out of the 7 billion humans believed them.

  • H over S, B over KW

    This looks about right. H, S, B, K, W
    MIT/COL/Haas/Tuck
    DUKE/Cornell/Yale/Ross

  • Red Layug

    I think the TOP 5 are still:

    Harvard & Stanford GSB
    Penn Wharton
    Berkeley HAAS
    MIT Sloan

    They are the hardest programs to get onto — they attract the best candidates.
    Their graduates are the most attractive by the top employers, whether in WS or SV.
    The average salary rate of their graduates are still the highest.

  • Red Layug

    It’s interesting to see Berkeley HAAS has outranked MIT Sloan in four of five major league tables.

    Berkeley HAAS > MIT Sloan.

  • Valid points, but Columbia and Wharton turn out more NYC-bound IB and VC grads where the salaries are high. So part of that is due to industry and location.

  • elitest

    LOL LOL ignorance is bliss : ) have u checked the salary rankings? which is a hard number and not BS qualitative nonsense
    columbia wharton are way ahead of stanford /booth/tuck/ never mind kellogg
    and trust me , no one I know who recruits and matters looks at P&Q rankings
    They read the FT MBA rankings and the WSJ overall rankings which focus on “salary and outcome”
    In Business Class and First class flights- people read the FT , not US news or P&Q
    I recruit at top 10 schools
    When I see Us news and P&Q in board rooms and in business class flights, I will believe your irrelevant rankings

  • ???? The average GMAT at Johnson is lower than Duke.

  • Johnsonite17

    Agreed. I got into Kellogg (with $), HBS (no $) and Yale SOM but choose Johnson. I also wanted a smaller, non-urban setting on the east coast, that was my main deciding factor.

    Didn’t apply to Fuqua bc I got a 710 on my GMAT and wanted to be around people with similar intellectual horsepower. Was a great campus though!

  • MBAconsulting

    Aggregated Ranking, utilizing posted stats from MBA class of 2018:

    1. Harvard
    2. Stanford
    3. Booth
    4. Wharton
    5. MIT
    6. Kellogg
    7. Haas
    8. CBS
    9. Yale SOM
    10. Tuck
    11. Ross
    12. UVA
    13. Johnson
    14. Fuqua
    15. UT Texas/UCLA (tied)

  • uXxlima

    solid list with replacing Yale by Cornell. Also, it is pretty obvious that Chicago Booth is real threat to Stanford for 2nd place.

  • Cornell 15′

    i got into Yale but went to Johnson FYI.

    When looking my rankings were
    1-HS
    2 W, Kellogg Booth, MIT
    3 Hass, Tuck, CBS
    4 Yale, Duke, Ross, Cornell, stern, ucla

    I wanted a smaller non-urban setting on the east coast.
    I applied to:
    Reach – Tuck
    Match – Yale, Duke, Cornell
    Safe – UNC

    I got into all of my match schools, and chose Johnson. Yale was 3rd on the list

  • Would definitely not go so far as that. What is good anyway? I work with a lot of people who’d make a conscious decision not to apply to HBS, or Wharton, because they don’t have the same culture ie more assholes than Kellogg, Haas, or Stanford

  • Duke is extremely popular with employers, and they make a specific a conscious choice not to fixate on GMAT, which I think is actually very intelligent. Very strong culture.

  • StanfordSucks

    This confirms it.

    Fearless forecast: Wharton and Columbia are sinking. Next year, Wharton will be below Kellogg and Columbia will be out of the top 10.

    2017 ranking will be

    1. Harvard
    2. Stanford/Booth
    4. Kellogg/MIT
    6. Wharton
    7. Tuck
    8. Ross
    9. Berkeley
    10. Fuqua
    11. Columbia/Darden
    13. Yale

  • HarvardWinsAgain

    Booth rocks! Now please displace that poser school from the Bay Area!

  • StanfordSucks

    Columbia is #10 and 11 in the top two rankings (USN and BW) so yeah no… try again

  • StanfordSucks

    This looks right to me. Best ranking ever. Well… I could do without Stanford. It is a has been

  • C. Taylor

    somSquared = johnsonSquared = fuquaSquared. Probably hasn’t graduated high school yet.

  • CrimsonCam

    I would be so pissed if I went to Stern and my school got dragged down bc of a BS administrative error by the staff. They deserve a much higher rank in USNWR and therefore P&Q….Probably not top 10 but definitely above Fuqua, UVA and Ross

  • MBA alum

    Fuqua wasn’t ranked higher than 12th in any of the four credible rankings? Not sure how you came to this conclusion but your name says it all…

  • BlueAngel

    Fuqua at 11!! It should be closer to #4-6. It’s an M7 yet ranked below 4 other schools??

    YA RITE!

  • DACochran

    figure it was that little troll. “SOMSquared” should just go back to their little dorm at Johnson and relax while the adults talk rankings.

  • RTCC

    eh not so sure about that….top 9 sound pretty good….not sure if I would put Duke even in that category. If anything top including Yale is just fine…maaaaybe you could argue for Ross being in there but deff not Duke.

  • thor

    Clearly you have a bone to pick with Fuqua. Honestly, just because SOM has ranked higher than Fuqua in USNWR, FT, Economist, and Forbes these past couple years doesn’t mean they aren’t interchangeable. Fuqua is 3rd in Businessweek and SOM is 14th! Businessweek is what MBB uses as their go to ranking.
    Don’t tell me that SOM’s avg. GMAT is 725 and Fuqua’s is 695…. GMAT isn’t representative of people’s academic potential.

  • FrequentFlyer

    Also agree with this. Currently at top consulting firm (not MBB) and we prioritize, HBS, GSB, Wharton, Kellogg, Booth, MIT as our top targets, then CBS, Tuck, SOM, Ross as secondary target. Then of course we have a few people trickling in from other not top 10 schools but in much smaller numbers.

  • MBA alum

    I agree with these points. Although I would say Yale and Darden more in line with Tuck. Columbia better than those three. Duke, Ross and Stern definitely photo finish though I agree

  • m7Snob

    Ya would love to see all of the kids at Fuqua or Johnson that got into Yale but decided to pass lol
    6th tier and move Fuqua to 7, Johnson just off the list entirely

    Glad SOMEONE finally puts Wharton where it belongs

  • Slieyii2

    haha ya Kellogg is more in the SOM, CBS wheelhouse…maybe slightly higher. Wouldn’t put it with HSW just yet.

  • heather

    Agreed. Duke is a great program. They don’t restrict students just because they lack the ‘traditional’ traits (i.e. very low avg. GMAT), and are a wonderful platform if you want to move into consulting. They send more students to Deloittes Atlanta office than any of the other M7s.

  • PurplePal

    Lol ya sure. I go to Kellogg so I have no skin in the game but I can tell you Duke (avg. gmat 690), UVA, and Ross are certainly not alternating in the 10 spot. SOM has clearly made its way beyond that group and was in my decision set of Kellogg, CBS, Dartmouth. I wouldn’t have gone to Fuqua even with a scholarship honesty.

  • DACochran

    I’ve heard similar statements from multiple MBB consultants, including one partner.

  • Orange1

    I respect John’s ranking, but real world, I would lump 4-5 together and the schools in 6-7 likewise. Again, splitting hairs…..

  • BSG

    As a business school student at a top school, I can say that your school’s name won’t matter at all when it comes to recruiting, your resume and how polished you are matters. People who attend HBS and Stanford get fantastic jobs because they were fantastic candidates even without the degree.

    The only real value add is you’ll have a stronger network in a better ranked school.

    I’ve known guys at a top twenty school get offers from Apple, Amazon, Facebook and Google for product and strategy roles while watching someone from a top 3 school struggling to get an offer from HP/Dell. The latter are stories you rarely hear, but it’s not uncommon in practice.

  • Jason

    Outside of that top 10 I would say it goes Ross, Darden, Kenan-Flagler, and Emory.

  • Cornell 15′

    Similar. I would push Duke to 10,
    all 10 are good places to land but I guess – HSW, Kellogg, Booth, Tuck, MIT, Haas, CBS, Duke

  • updated2017rankings

    2017 tiers look like:

    1. Harvard/Stanford
    2. Wharton
    3. Booth/Kellogg/MIT
    4. Columbia
    5. Haas/Tuck
    6. Ross/Fuqua/Johnson/Darden/SOM
    7. Anderson/Stern

  • heather

    What would the top 10 rankings be if we were talking for students that are trying to break into Consulting?

  • RTCC

    sorry .. behind the delay..

  • RTCC

    John, why do you think the reason behind Bloomberg ranking for international MBA? it is two weeks since they released the US version.

  • Stanford

    Lol Wharton and Kellogg are equal? Omg, I wonder how much $ Kellogg pays to people compiling the rankings.

  • MBA alum

    P&Q does not need to toot its own horn. Many of us frequently take advantage of sound data analytics in our decision making process at work. Thus, we like to complement good data analytics by others. That is why I drew the analogy to FiveThirtyEight website (Nate Silver) that has taken the national leadership in accuracy of polling and now moved into other areas like sports. I happen to like how P&Q frequently points out its methodology and reviews some of the limitations of its findings. Using sound data analytics related to the identification of the best MBA programs is symbolic since all these programs emphasize data analytics.

  • Consultant23 is wrong

    And yet you are commenting on this website.

  • That’s not me! I never masquerade.

  • Good one!

    I have a feeling this is the same “SOMSquared” troll who has a sick fetish for literally trolling every single article with worshiping SOM (even though s/he obviously doesn’t go there) and trashing CBS and Cornell (his/her favorite targets for whatever reason)

  • Good one!

    Look at John Byrne over here, masquerading as a random P&Q reader, pumping himself up!

  • MBA alum

    You
    make a very good point related to how careers tend to evolve over the long-run. Yet, where you get your MBA can make a significant
    difference for students seeking to secure a job with the most elite firms, such
    as breaking into a Goldman Sachs or a VC/PE firm. While there are always exceptions, your MBA
    brand can make an incremental difference in the early stages of your
    career. Most importantly, if you are not
    seeking to work for one of the most competitive employers, then your MBA brand
    is not nearly as important in the early stages of your career.

  • Just another man

    Once you get to the top ten schools, or maybe even the top 20 schools, success for individual graduates is largely determined by their personal abilities, drive, tenacity and perseverance. Which school you attend is not going to fix flaws in its graduates. So other than some bragging rights on attending #3 instead of #5, I am not sure it matters that much

  • MMJ

    John, you may want to check your P&Q published stats on Wharton’s acceptance rate. It appears incorrect. It seems it is erroneously the ratio of number of enrolled students to number of applicants. Should of course be number of offers to applicants.
    Maybe now Wharton will rank even lower???

  • elitist

    I agree CBS and stern people make much more in $ than booth and kellogg and tuck
    P&Q assigns random weights to different rankings to reflect their own bias
    Unless the rankings are audited , there is a lot of inherent bias
    I recruit MBA’s from all top schools.

  • hikhak

    come on.. I heard about Kellogg somewhere.. but certainly outside P&Q. If I am correct it is good school to study business.

  • Consultant23 is wrong

    The HBS Hopeful is correct. The top 7 schools by people who do not look at business rankings every year (that’s a majority) and don’t sit on P&Q would be as following:

    1) Harvard
    2) Stanford
    3) Wharton
    4) Columbia
    5) Chicago
    6) MIT
    7) Kellogg

    Just to add, Harvard and Stanford are waaaaaay too good when compared to school like Kellogg. No one even knows what Kellogg is outside of this website. lol

  • Consultant23

    “Ivy League” means nothing for business schools. Cornell and Yale and Columbia are Ivy League. Stanford and booth and mit are not. Yet all are higher ranked schools. These rankings reflect simply how many kids get how many jobs from the most sought after employers and are rated most highly by those same employers (which is what most people I think would agree is the purpose of business school). And on those metrics, as nearly every ranking reflects not to mention the schools endowments which reflect how many wealthy alums have given to the schools, Columbia is handily outstripped by a number of non Ivy League schools including Stanford, Chicago and probably northwestern and mit too.

  • Orange 1

    Well put MBA alum. And some of the factors are fit more than anything else. Columbia and Tuck are close in the rankings, yet rural New Hampshire is 180 degrees different than upper Manhattan – very different in terms of atmosphere and networking opportunities (perhaps that is why Tuck alumni are so loyal due to being relatively isolated at school).
    I would rank UCLA, Stern, Ross, Darden, Yale, Cornell, and Duke in a photo finish. But if I wanted to work in the entertainment industry I would pick UCLA to attend. Interested in living in the Southeast? Duke is very hard to beat.

  • HBS Hopeful

    Good luck studying at Kellogg.

  • randomguy

    When reading your response I regret even responding to your original comment.

    Good luck on your apps., as it looks like you may need it.

  • HBS Hopeful

    Rankings are BS, they change all the time. However the fact that you went to Columbia rather than UChicago or northwestern will stay with you forever. People compiling the rankings and loser recruiters might disagree, but these are less than 1% of people to whom you will be telling where you went to school.

    Funny how you think that your ability to read the numbers correctly in the flawed rankings makes an expert in MBA programs.

  • randomguy

    I think it’s clear that you have no idea what you’re talking about, not to mention your NYC bias. Anyone who has glanced at the rankings this past year knows that Stern has dropped due to a US News issue earlier this year, and “it’s an Ivy League school” (when referring to Columbia) really means nothing. Make sure you brush up on your logical reasoning for the GMAT.

    Also, “a first job in finance or consulting”? All firms hire for the same positions out of all programs. The bottom line is that Booth, Kellogg, and MIT have been performing significantly better in most rankings in comparison to Columbia, and finance is not the end all/be all. I don’t put much stock into individual rankings, but in my mind M7 stands as the pinnacle with H/S at the top.

  • HBS Hopeful

    The real top 4 MBA programs are below:
    1) Harvard
    2) Stanford
    3) Wharton
    4) Columbia

    Columbia is much better then Booth and Kellogg, it’s an Ivy League school and is in NYC. Certainly a better brand if you care about your future. People go to booth and Kellogg just to get a first job in finance or consulting

    Also surprised that Stern is so low.

  • DACochran

    I don’t have an opinion either way but curious: what data are you talking about specifically where SOM is outpacing CBS?

  • paten@sualumni.net

    You only put 8 schools in your top 9.

  • datageek

    Yale SOM has solidified itself as a top 10, all the data backs this up. CBS on the other hand is declining, it’s possible it will be #11-#13 next cycle.

  • Top Tier MBA

    Actually, since the FT and Economist rankings combine both US and International schools, and since the Business Week, Forbes, and US News rankings do not, this approach would increase the credibility of the P&Q composite ranking you came up with as well.

  • Top Tier MBA

    You should just throw out the FT and Economist ranks and make this a US centric ranking. There has been enough variability in both the FT and Economist rankings to give them a weight of 0%.

  • MBA alum

    I agree that we should not have the MBA ranking determined by a single salary number or any other single variable. To illustrate this point, let’s look at two comparable MBA programs in this national ranking: #17 NYU Stern and #18 University of Texas McCombs. They generate similar average base salaries for key attractive employment fields, such as investment banking and consulting. However, NYU does better in salary and bonuses both at graduation and over time due to their respective geographic and industry preferences. NYU MBA program has nearly 85% of its class working in higher paying NYC region and 28% working the higher paying investment banking area. This is in sharp contrast to UT that has 63% of their class working in the lower paying southwest region (only 6% in northeast) and only 10% working in the higher paying investment banking field. Clearly, students who want to work in NYC or IB will pick NYU Stern over UT, but there are other compelling reasons that other MBAs may pick UT over NYU. It would be like determining which is the best undergraduate school by solely comparing average starting salaries for undergraduates at graduation. Engineering oriented schools like MIT and Cal Tech would have clear advantage over liberal arts schools like Harvard, Yale and Princeton in average salaries. Yet, few persons want to solely determine the best undergraduate schools by salaries alone. It is far better to evaluate schools based on a variety of variables with weighting some variables greater than others.

  • The reason we assign weights to each ranking is because we believe some lists are more credible than others. We make these judgments based on our knowledge of the methodologies that each ranking employs. It’s no accident that I created the very first MBA ranking in 1988 and know a lot of what goes on behind the scenes with regards to what gets included and what doesn’t and why. If we wanted to get more traffic on the ranking–and indirectly more ad sales–we wouldn’t do it this way. Applying the weights makes the list more stable because the changes on a less credible ranking is greatly diminished. The quality of an MBA program, moreover, cannot be reduced to just a salary number at some arbitrary point in time. If you want to measure the quality of a business school, you need to look at a variety of factors and that is what all the rankings do, including this one. That includes the actual learning experience, the quality of incoming students, the ability of a school to get you a job in the first place.

  • elitist

    what is the basis to assign certain weights for certain rankings? where is the proof? Attempt to keep rejigging numbers to get more ad sales? more ads for P&Q?
    why cant u just use salaries after 5 years and 10 years? thats a hard single number

  • NULL NULL

    John, something seems off about Foster’s ranking. Please re-check.

  • E

    Georgetown was ranked 19th in the US by Financial Times in 2016; not 38th.

  • thor

    What did I first notice about this ranking?
    1. That there is a solid top 9 — the M7 + Haas & Tuck
    2. That there is significant drop from #9 (Columbia) to #10 (Yale this year, but more likely an alternating spot among Duke, Virginia and Michigan.
    3. That the TOP 9 is further divided by 3 groups:
    Group 1 – Stanford GSB & HBS (99.3 -100)
    Group 2 – Wharton, Both and Kellogg (96.9 – 97.7)
    Group 3 – Haas, Sloan & Tuck (94 – 94.2)

    — gap—

    #10, #11, #12 & #13 — they alternate at #10.

  • MBA alum

    Well done. It
    is ironic that the new hot course at all of the top ten MBA programs is various
    forms of Data Analytics. An
    important component of every one of these classes is how to increase market research validity and reliability, such as reducing selection and sampling error. Unlike many of his competitors in the MBA
    rankings business, P&Q seems to have taken this class. P&Q’s ranking research methodology reminds me of the website FiveThirtyEight and its founder Nate Silver, who aggregate various polls and weight the polls based on their judgment of the
    accuracy of each respective poll. While
    538, like almost all of the recent election polls, were not able to call the most recent
    Presidential Election, 538 historically has proven to be the most accurate in
    predicting elections outcomes.
    It is
    refreshing to see P&Q use a similar measured approach with greater emphasis
    on weighting of the MBA rankings based on P&Q’s judgment of the relative
    accuracy of each MBA ranking. After
    seeing all the pushback on its recent MBA rankings results, I would think that Bloomberg
    Businessweek readership base wishes that John A. Byrne was still serving as its
    Executive Editor and Editor-in-Chief.

  • I think I can hear the sound of champagne bottles opening at Kellogg